rebelutionary
Mike Cannon-Brookes on Java, J2EE, OSX, Open Source, Australia, Atlassian, Bug Tracking, JIRA and more...

Saturday, 25 May 2002

Linked twice in one day - I feel so popular! David Watson responded to my thoughts about J2EE vendors not contributing to Open Source projects - and thus shooting themselves in the foot when they try to get some love from developers. Me: So why does BEA seem to hate Open Source? For that matter, are there any J2EE vendors who contribute to Open Source? (Apart from JBoss - they don't count!) David: The answer to that final question is complicated, but it has a lot to do with Sun's J2EE licensing which seemingly works against open source projects, notably enhydra and jboss (the latter of which I'm an an enthusiastic supporter, having suffered with BEA at the hands of some ill-headed executives). See this article for more details.  [www.davidwatson.org] My point wasn't about certification (I'll get to that later) - it was about marketing. Other companies (like IBM, Apple and Sun to some extent) have learnt that contributing to Open Source projects has two main benefits - getting free code, and getting a good reputation amongst developers. J2EE vendors are desperate to seduce and befriend developers, yet none of them (with the exception perhaps of IBM) contribute heavily to Open Source enterprise Java projects. Why? On certification, I'm not sure I agree here. Yes, Sun's J2EE licensing does work against Open Source implementations. Enhydra and JBoss are totally different cases as I understand it though (from talking to the JBoss folks at JBoss One and reading the Denise Cooper's interview on Slashdot). The biggest problem with licensing J2EE to an Open Source implementation is not paying the fees, the JBoss group could pay those fees today, the problem seems to be with derivative works. Historically the problem with JBoss was not so much whether or not they could afford to access the certification test suite, as whether it or any Open Source project was potentially a weakening of the value proposition. JBoss is an open source project. According to the Open Source Definition, JBoss can't pass on compatibility requirements to subsequent code licensees. Open Source advocates have repeatedly assured us that the social contract (which is the primary method of enforcement in the Open Source world) is strong enough to protect the value proposition if branding was optional, but readily admit they can offer no guaranty. Java-related open source activities such as TomCat have been very popular, but uptake for the associated compatibility suite has been limited. As I understand it, if JBoss was certified - and I modified it slightly and created my own RebelutionaryBoss - could I claim certification too? Doesn't that open a Pandora's box? Perhaps I'm not understanding it all properly (or falling for Sun's marketing lingo). It will be really interesting to see how this all pans out in the end. I really wish JBoss could be certfified. It's not my favourite server, but it's sufficiently better than the other bloated crappy servers out there - and it can improve rapidly (as 3.x shows). 5:53:20 PM  comment []      Sam Ruby pointed to me and advised checking out Roller. It looks light a good start, and I might try hacking on it. I like client side blogs though, and it seems very server side. Perhaps embedding Jetty in Roller, and communicating via XML-RPC with Charles Miller's RCS implementation would be an interesting project (basically we could recreate Radio using Open Source Java technologies). I wonder if Dave Winer would like that very much. 5:41:48 PM  comment []      Xbox struggling with math test. For the software publishing industry, video games are a numbers game. And for now, Microsoft is on the losing end. Game publishers say it's a simple matter of economics. Just bought Amped today (as I've almost finished Halo). I hope Microsoft is in for the long haul, if they are I think they'll win through sheer technological superiority - but it will be a long and ugly fight. [CNET News.com] 5:34:48 PM  comment []      armidale looks like a very interesting Java Open Source project (by Aussies!). armidale is a set of open source Java programs and libraries designed to radically simplify the development, deployment and use of web applications that have rich graphical user interfaces. Armidale applications are developed using the armidale API as if they were stand-alone programs. They can then be run on stand-alone computers or installed on an armidale server. When installed on a server, armidale applications can be run by clients around the internet (or intranet) using the armidale application launcher. This client launcher displays the user interface of armidale applications running on remote servers. A high level, light weight message protocol between the server and its clients ensures that armidale applications respond well to user interaction. Basically like Sash (small, lightweight Internet applications) I think. One to look at in more detail later. 5:28:53 PM  comment []      Swing or DOM - should DHTML replace Swing? In my opinion no, Java GUIs are not dead at all - if anything they're steadily growing and improving (see IDEA for one example of a very fast, Swing based, cross platform application). People like this: "Instead 99% of Java-based frontends are being done in the browser with some variation of D/HTML/XML. Why have the overhead of the entire Swing library in the JVM if only 1% of the world is using it?" clearly have little idea about the Java scene. GUIs are not dead, and programming HTML in an OO way is very, very ugly (see ECS). Whereas others: "Replacing Swing my not be the right answer but, there is something to this. Why not J2WE Java 2 Web Edition? A light weight plugin that will access the document model. Like Sashxb but with java. The download could be 1 or 2 meg." clearly get it. I'm glad to see some people get the idea. Sash is a truly excellent technology, one that is waiting for an application I feel. But the killer is this: It's easy to embed applets in web pages, but it's almost impossible to show web pages in a Java application. Ay, there's the rub. Many times could I have built cool Java applications (like a Java rich client version of Radio based on JXTA) but the lack of a Swing HTML display pane has stopped that. Pity. 5:23:47 PM  comment []      If I Was Scott McNealy and Had Responsibility for Open Office! is an interesting piece (rant?) by Scott Johnson. While he makes some interesting points, I'm not sure that Microsoft's licensing people would really appreciate you using a single copy of Office to convert documents for the world - and charge for it. I have enough faith in the sneakiness of M$' lawyers that this wouldn't be legal. Still, it's a great idea. You should also look at and contribute to the Jakarta POI project. Their aim is: The POI project consists of APIs for manipulating various file formats based upon Microsoft's OLE 2 Compound Document format using pure Java. OLE 2 Compound Document Format based files include most Microsoft Office files such as XLS and DOC. As far as I can see the are actually collaborating with the Open Office folks and also with a number of other projects. Only Excel files seem 'workable' at the moment, but it all bodes well. Perhaps Sun should consider funding a project like this? 5:06:41 PM  comment []      The Register has an article about the new preview release of Netscape 7. Looks good, personally I think I'm the only OSX fan who doesn't think IE is bad. It works well for me. (Still I think the review means AIM when it says NS7 ships with ICQ support). El Reg makes mistakes often, but we still love them. 2:31:54 AM  comment []      Apple aims to boost bandwidth with 1.5GHz G4s. Not that exciting as my trusty iBook (still the best laptop ever made) still hums along fine on a G3. Still, for that new dual G4 desktop Java workstation - the 1.5 G4s would go nicely with the Cinema Display. One day. [The Register] 2:29:43 AM  comment []